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Travels and personal perspectives on Iloilo and Panay Island
Our house project: shopping for cement blocks
Tags: Crime, Hollow Block Iloilo, Iloilo Building Materials, Iloilo Cement Block, Iloilo Concrete Block, Iloilo Fence, philippine crime, Tigbauan Fence, water pump
Shopping for cement blocks (called hollow block) in the Philippines is certainly not a top pick adventure story but anyway, perhaps someone will benefit from our experiences. Really, this is one chapter in the building of our Philippine house in Tigbauan, Iloilo.
We’re fencing the lot we bought in Tigbauan with a cement block wall. Why? To keep out roaming carabaos, but mainly because we will be filling the lot to raise its level so that our house won’t flood during typhoons. Since we’ll be putting in up to one meter of fill, a wall to needed to retain the fill. The wall may add to our security to some small extent.
Carabao "helps" our surveyor at our Tigbauan lot.
Why do we need to fill our lot before building a house? This photo is just after typhoon Frank left Tigbauan.
The above photo shows usual flooding conditions in Philippine rice growing lands. The soils are very heavy clay and tend to retain rain water — perfect for growing rice but not really ideal for residential development and especially not ideal of septic systems.
Many expats are willing and able to get personally involved in construction projects; hiring, supervising and firing local employees, shopping and bargaining for materials, getting permits and all the rest. Bob did not feel comfortable with doing that so we hired an architect to develop the plans and to oversee the project. Plans? Yes, a building permit is required for the wall and to get a permit plans are needed. We also wanted plans and specification to ensure that the wall was actually built the way we wanted it to be built. We heard lots of stories about poor quality block. We told the architect that we wanted top quality block and that we wanted to approve the quality of the block in advance of its purchase and delivery. That is proving to be more difficult than we thought.
Our architect knew of a major supplier of block to the Iloilo area so we piled into his car to visit the Damasco block plant in Pavia, Iloilo. The firm had a small storefront in “downtown” Pavia, so that was our first stop. They showed us their standard 4″ block. I really don’t have much experience with block and don’t know proper methodology or equipment for testing it, but here’s what I did. I brought along my 20 oz. Estwing hammer. My theory was that rapping a block would at least determine if it would easily crumble. The ring of hard concrete would also contrast with the dull sound of a over-sandy block.
It was immediately clear that the block we were looking at was weak. When hit it, there was a very dull thud sound, not the ring of hard concrete. It was easy to tap a hole in the block. Anyway, this is a standard block used in most Philippine building projects. When used in a house or wall they are not really structural. The block is are reinforced with rebar, filled with wet concrete and then parged with concrete on both sides. So, the explanation is that the strength of the individual block is not that important. These blocks are made to sell for little money. The block I ruined with my Estwing cost P9.75. Doubtless, this price would be reduced with discounts. Hence the block is mostly sand with not much concrete. I have seen worse. I went to one block plant that made blocks so weak you could crush them with your shoe.
Since our fence was not to be parged, we wanted a less crumbly block. The worker at the storefront sent us back to the yard where the blocks are made. Damasco’s was an impressively big operation. The owner was very articulate about global warming, the Greenland ice cap and Al Gore. He said the standard block were manufactured at seventy blocks per bag of concrete. (A bag of concrete costs about P200.) He said the strength of these standard blocks is 300 PSI. He showed us some well-cured 700 PSI block. Forty blocks are made with one bag of concrete. I did the “Estwing test” on these. These were much better, but still not comparable to block I had handled in the U.S. The owner said he would custom make 700 PSI block for us, but the cost quoted to us is just about double that of the 300 PSI block. Is it any wonder that most use the cheaper block! Using better block would add about $1,000 to our fence project cost. Also the better block is custom made. The special order takes three weeks to produce.
After looking at and testing dozens of blocks, I decided to use the Damasco 6″ standard block. The quality of Damasco’s standard block seems better than the competition. Why 6″? The price is only P1 more than the 4″. That’s the only justification I can advance. We are paying P13 per 6″ hollow block delivered to our Tigbauan building site. The first 2100 block have arrived and we are very pleased with them. However, keep in mind that we probably could have bought local block for P7 each.
We have friends in Dumaguete who feel our approach to fence building is extravagant. Here’s the comments:
“For a fence, 10mm rebar is fine, 12mm is over kill and costly, IMO, if the footings is half again wider then the block size and 10mm rebar in the footing. 6″ block is over kill for a fence also, IMO. 4″ block fencing has stood for generations, even the not so good blocks and without finishing, unless your building a 8′/10′ walls? Also, I DO NOT do the columns with fencing or any hollow block building. IMO, that’s over kill also and more costly with the rebar cages. Over lapping each row of blocks by a half block and filling with concrete is what is done in the States and has served well. That gives you a solid wall when finished. What I’m saying is, filling each row make the hollow blocks the form for the wall and no form materials left over. The problem with Pinoys, they want to use the block set mix to fill. That’s a NO-NO! Concrete with chipped rock is to be the fill! In other words, two different mixes are needed in building with hollow blocks, fence or building!!”
Other expats have said that the only way to get good quality block is to make it yourself. You can buy some forms and hire workers to make them just the way you want them. What we’ve seen so far lends support to this approach.
We also looked at 36″ x 18″ precast tiles for our well. We got to see them being made. The quality seemed excellent.
Making culvert/well tiles at Damascos, Pavia Iloilo
Making culvert/well tiles at Damasco, Pavia Iloilo
Poor quality hollow block, crushed with my shoe
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Posted by GOIloilo on 01.10.09 12:50PM under Our House Project
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Posted by natie on 01.11.09 7:55 am
wow, thanks for the update, bob…very interesting! yes, a wall is a necessity for your project, unless you plan to be there 24/7 (and to be awake as a guard, too, 24/7) if you don’t, the building materials will ”grow legs” and walk away…
now the fun begins…my sister and law and brother (had a house project in DBLedesma 3-4 yrs ago) experienced frustration over the ”lagay” system in obtaining permits and such..after being away for many, many years from the country, it was a very hard pill to swallow.
when i did mine, i countered the minor problem with the system called “palakasan”, or ‘who do you know’…i don’t have to pay under the table for expedience…
Posted by B-Ray on 01.11.09 10:06 am
Well now people, do I need to write a BOOK? LMAO
As yet, I haven’t gone through everything you write about. So, bits is in order here ie…..hollow blocks.
Telling a Pinoy, QUOTE: “We told the architect that we wanted top quality block”, is like piss’n in the wind and getting wet, PERIOD!! You’ll get a “YES SIR” and get “WHATEVER” they want to give you and with a foreign face involved, twice the price, COUNT ON IT!!
9.75 pesos for a 4″ SUB-STANDARD block, tells the story, IMO!
From what I have seen, dealing with Pinoy made hollow blocks, 80 to 100 per sack of cement is common. Then, what TYPE of sand is used in the mix makes a B-I-G difference! Many Pinoys will use illegal gotten sea sand and the salt is a KILLER! When we built our own blocks for the 2 story, we avg. 53 per sack and used ONLY black sand which has a binder in it at a cost of 3.5 pesos each, (made 2,500), in 2004.
If I was to do this again, I would have to figure the mix again since OLD AGE has caught up with me!
Another thing we did was using a 1 bagger mixer to insure the proper mix. The Pinoy, “that’s good enough”, hand mix wasn’t exceptable!
QUOTE: “My theory was that rapping a block would at least determine if it would easily crumble. The ring of hard concrete would also contrast with the dull sound of a over-sandy block.”
Not a bad test “AT ALL” my friend!! Another “test” is to take 3 fingers on the outside of the ear of the block and the thumb at the top and pinch as hard as you can. Not as effective as above, but if the test fails, (most Pinoy made blocks will), you know what’s there.
Now, for the bottom line in reguards to hollow blocks. We have bought Pinoy built housing, built for Pinoys, to remoldel for rentals and after 18 years since built, they haven’t fall’n down. Granted, all we bought is a lot with 4 walls and a roof, maybe windows, called a house.
Foundation, collums and beams are the backbone of a building. Hollow blocks just fills inbetween. When you add the “FINSHING” to the blocks with a mix of one to one by 1/2″ thick, will give a hard surface.
Don’t expect Pinoys to build a true smooth wall!! Finshing makes up the difference and what is called a termit finish, is your best bet for looks. Basicly, hids the ocean waves in the walls! LOL
B-Ray
Posted by GOIloilo on 01.11.09 10:23 am
Natie, so far (knock on wood!) our experiences have been so good. Our Iloilo lawyer is a sweetheart and the whole process of buying our lot from a private seller (a retired judge) was flawless. We already have the title. Same with our dealings with Tigbauan officials. Everything on the up-and-up so far. We have been treated very well by our Ilonggo neighbors.
Posted by GOIloilo on 01.11.09 10:37 am
B-Ray — you should write a book! Thanks for the feedback. Construction should start next week; building the shed for workers and materials and digging the well. 18 36″ (diameter) x 20″ well tiles. The tiles we looked at were really good. The fence will require about 5,000 block. The block is not really the big cost — it’s the rebar and concrete. I won’t tell you what we are paying because you’ll laugh at me! Remember, it’s 180 lineal meters of wall. We’ll keep you posted. Bob and Carol
Posted by natie on 01.12.09 12:44 pm
no, i won’t laugh since up to now, our wall isn’t 100% done…part of the front wall is made out of chicken wire and some bamboo–THAT will really keep the bad guys out!! haha..still waiting for some extra cash–maybe we’ll be waiting for a long while..
seems like b-ray’s been through that same road..you must have pinched a few blocks. i’m ever thankful to my brother in law who kept eagle-eyes over the architect and the workers, as well as the accounting of funds.
keep us posted, bob and carol..it snowed again yesterday, and this week we’ll have temps on the teens! but i guess you know that thru your kindle!!
Posted by Weng on 01.15.09 3:58 pm
Hi Bob and Carol,
Greetings!
I am an avid fun of your blog. Thanks for the the info and updates. By the way, if you can email me the cost of construction materials as i am also planning to build a house there by myself. However, i’m not yet there in the philippines to do the survey so if you could email me or post here in your blog i would really appreciate it. International prices already down but i’m not sure there in the philippines especially iloilo.
another thing, how do you plan to do your septic tank. I think there is no drainage there for the waste to go out so i think it’s quite a problem.
Posted by GOIloilo on 01.15.09 4:55 pm
Hi Weng. Glad your finding the blog useful. We’ll try to post material prices as we learn about them. Since we have a fixed-price contract with my architect, we don’t always know the prices. If you’re planning to build a house, we suggest using P15,000 per square meter as a rough guideline with P20,000 for something quite deluxe. This includes tile floors, finishing and the septic system.
Speaking of septic systems, you have a good point. If you buy in an established subdivision, you’ll likely have access to a drainage system which will take away (probably to the nearest stream or river) your “septage” — the output of the septic system. Where our property is located there is no drainage system to hook into. We have to take care of our own septage disposal, plus we have to worry about the septic systems of future neighbors. In the U.S. a septic system would never be allowed on a site like ours. We very heavy clay and very poor drainage. In the U.S. the solution would to be to bring in fill with good septic characteristics and put a leaching system in the fill. Since we’re putting in lots of fill, this may be a possibility for us. The architects we’ve spoken with don’t seem too interested in this approach. Since the leach field is above the septic tank, a sewerage pump is required.
We located our well as far as possible from our own well and from our boundaries to give us the best protection from the drainage of future neighbors.
Hopefully, as our neighborhood develops, the municipal authorities will build or require a proper drainage system.
Posted by Weng on 01.17.09 4:15 pm
Hi Bob and Carol,
Thanks for your reply. Yeah please do post the prices of construction materials if you have a chance. That would be a great help to me as i am budgeting now for the house. By the way, i was informed by a friend that prices of materials in manila is a lot cheaper already compared to last year and the pther previous years. I don’t know though if it’s tue in iloilo. Hope it is so that i could save more on my budgets.
As to the septic systems that is what i am mostly worried of. If there’s no drainage one would be forced to spend regularly in hiringe a private company for cleaning the septic tank everytime it’s full. I learned it’s quite expensive there, 8 to 10k per service. Thanks for sharing also your thoughts about this matter. Just can help but worry about this.
By the way, may i know who is your architect or anyone can refer their good architects there in iloilo.
Thanks again.
Posted by natie on 01.18.09 6:29 am
weng, hope you don’t mind my input…my architect was alex bachalian..i’m quite pleased with the project. it was behind-schedule, but i didn’t mind–i had time to ”work my tush off” trying to keep up with the expenses. of course, it went over budget since the economy was (and still is) very unstable..
good luck and God bless all our projects…
Posted by GOIloilo on 01.18.09 4:04 pm
Weng,
Steel (rebar, roof trusses and metal roofing) is a big part of the cost of building. It should be going down because the world market price of steel is tumbling down. How long that will take to reach the Iloilo building supply dealer, we don’t know. I don’t think concrete has come down. We have not paid too much attention to material prices as we locked ourselves into a fixed price contract for the fence. We’ll pay much more attention when it comes to building our house.
We are using architect Jose Mari B. (Jomari) Moleta for the fence project. 033-338-3800, mobile 09198921995. We’ll see how that goes before we decide on an architect for the house. We have also had discussions with Joemarie Yao, a quite talented designer and builder. His design-build firm is JV Landmark Inc., 033-337-3624, 033-336-6052 email: jv_landmark@yahoo.com.ph
Again, one thing to keep in mind regarding septage disposal is that almost all lots in Iloilo must be filled, perhaps as much as a meter. If the fill material is carefully chosen it can contain a septic tank and leaching field.
Posted by Our house project: building a hollow block perimeter wall at goILOILO.com on 01.31.09 11:16 am
[...] See: http://goiloilo.com/our-house-project-cement-blocks/ [...]
Posted by Jim Monreal on 02.14.09 12:34 am
Bob is right on his estimate of between P15,000 to P20,000 per square meter to build a house. We just finished a 1-storey 24 square meter addition to our vacation house in Antipolo, Rizal at a cost of approximately less than P19,000 per square meter. The finished project consist of 1 bedroom with a private toilet & bath, window A/C, and french door; open patio with ceiling fan/light combo, outdoor kitchen with S/S sink and gas cooking stove on a tile counter top; concrete tile roof; “Mariwasa” non-skid tile floor all over; laundry machine; 2 additional septic tanks; paint and all fixtures. I don’t have the cost of materials, but labor cost was P400 a day per (Mason) person.
Posted by GOIloilo on 02.14.09 4:55 am
Hi Jim,
Thanks for your feedback. I think things may be a bit cheaper in Iloilo, at least as far as labor is concerned — more like P300 for a skilled worker and P200 for a laborer.
Posted by Digging our well in Tigbauan, Philippines at goILOILO.com on 07.16.09 8:28 pm
[...] Philippine wells almost always use precast concrete well tiles. Since we wanted our well to be good and to have a big capacity we specified that big tiles be used. We shopped around and found well tiles. More about that at http://goiloilo.com/our-house-project-cement-blocks/ [...]
Posted by ritchard bylow on 01.09.10 3:13 am
hello, we are planning to build about 3.5 hours south of iloilo, but will have to buy most materials from iloilo, we plan to use wood trusses ,, do you know any one who builds them in iloilo, and we need cabinets (kitchen and bathrooms ) and are finding it hard to find a supplier or a good cabinet maker ,, can you help , thank you , and yes i understand a bout the hollow sand blocks ,, some are now saying 400 psi, and this is very doubting if they are even 200.. i am a canadian marred for 18 years and 2 children and want to build in the next 8 weeks or so, but we are not ritch , just love the philippines ,and yes iloilo is great place . thanks bud ,and all on this site .. sincerly ritchard
Posted by GOIloilo on 01.10.10 10:55 am
Ritchard,
Sorry I can’t help with a cabinet maker. I’ll be facing that myself. I did have some bookcases made by a contractor. I found bookcase designs I liked online, printed out photos and gave them to a contractor. I specified that they be built with 5/4 lumber so that the shelves would not sag. They are not fine furniture but they are sturdy and attractive. We built them of Lauaan (Philippine Mahogany).
Many cabinets are made by the carpenters involved in the house project. Usually they are acceptable but not great. There are furniture shops in Iloilo. These may be your best bet for good cabinets. There is one furniture shop on Compania street in Molo – I think it’s called San Jose woodworking. The owners name is Issac. They are pretty skilled but must often work to modest price point and use less expensive wood. If you specify better wood and top workmanship, I suspect you could get good quality out of them.
One big problem is that Philippine forests have been almost totally logged off so obtaining the fabulous old growth hardwoods which furniture used to be made from is very difficult. A friend get around this by buying beams and lumber from old houses and reusing it for door and window casings and cabinets. I have some photos of the beams being resawn by two guys using a crosscut saw. They work day after day making lumber from those old beams.
Posted by Our house project: getting started at last at goILOILO.com on 01.31.10 7:35 am
[...] block is a surprisingly small part of total construction cost. More on hollow block shopping at http://goiloilo.com/our-house-project-cement-blocks/ At the end of our first week of construction the first concrete is [...]
Posted by Building our Philippine House – Index at goILOILO.com on 02.08.10 6:26 am
[...] kubo” Our Philippine house: Buying construction equipment Our Philippine house: Buying hollow block (cement block) Our Philippine house: Foundation and footers Our Philippine house: Concrete Columns Tie Beams [...]